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Thread: Engine & Cooling

  1. #21
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    Thumbs up Oo-rah!

    Dang nice numbers! Traction is gonna be a fun search, I think. What have you decided on for tires?

    560 ft/lbs from a small block.....I don't think you're going to go looking for more power any time soon .
    Yeehah

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurnpikeBoy View Post
    Dang nice numbers! Traction is gonna be a fun search, I think. What have you decided on for tires?

    560 ft/lbs from a small block.....I don't think you're going to go looking for more power any time soon .
    Based on all my research, I went with the best road legal (DOT) race/street tire I could get… i.e, the Avon Racing Motorsport CR6ZZ tires. 295/50R-15 rears and 245/60R-15 fronts. Only issue with Avon Racing tires are, very $s expensive and only a few sources in the US to purchase. I found only 4 based on the dealer locator on the Avon Racing web site….. here’s the link to Avon Racing http://www.avonracing.com/home.html

    You also mention the high eng torque….. well, I also ordered a 3.73 posi-traction rear…. So torque will be crazy!
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  3. #23
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    Fuel and Oil systems

    Here's a drawing for the oil and fuel systems and layout.
    For the fuel system, I ended up with the Aeromotive electric fuel pump AEI-11203, 100 and 10 micron fuel filters (AEI-12308 & 12318) and a Aeromotive Fuel Pressure Regulator AEI-13205.
    For the Oil, I went with all Canton Racing products Accusump 3qt pre oiler (24-280), 2 CM Canister Oil Filters (25-106 large screen & 25-826 fine screen), Remote Oil Filter rotating/90 degs adapter (22-595), Oil Cooler Thermostat (22-480) and Oil Cooler.
    The Accusump will pre oil the engine with 3 qt’s of oil before startup. At engine startup, the Accusump will refill with 3qts of oil. If oil pressure should ever drop low while engine is running, the Accusump would provide oil until pressure increased.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  4. #24
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    Avon

    Guees who makes the AVON Tires??? Cooper Tire in Ohio, intresting.
    Rick
    427 S/C , 427 Side-oiler, 4 Speed Close Ratio Top Loader, 3:73 Gear
    #4279405

  5. #25
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    Rick, you sure? Avon Racing is a British company. In fact, I had to wait for the "boat to come in" (literally) with their container of ordered tires. I did read somewhere that Cooper made Micky Thompson DOT legal tires? I believe I'd challenge the Avon's being made by Cooper. Do you have any links.... I'd be interested to know more?

    Thanks Mark
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  6. #26
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    update:
    Rick.... you kind of have it right based on further research I just did. It appears Cooper may own Avon... but Avon still does it "own thing" and manufactures it's tires in England. So it may be safe to say Cooper owns Avon, but the Cooper /Ohio does not manufacture Avon tires. If it every gets to Avon tire are no different than a Cooper tire.... well, people would not pay the $s and stop buying Avon. All the above based on some quick searches for what it's worth. Mark
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkassab View Post
    here's the dyno sheet
    For the engine gurus and experts:

    Why do they start the dyno results at 4400prm?



    Why don't they start off idle to see the whole torque/horsepower range?



    Peaks are great... and important, but it seems that knowing how it performs down low is important too...

    Thanks!
    Paul

    289 USRRC
    1964 289 5-bolt block
    Toploader and 3.31 rear

  8. #28
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    You know Paul.... I had the same thought and failed to ask that question while there last Thur..... I'll have to defer to the board for that one.... Brent... please comment on this one.

    Mark
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  9. #29
    Yes, I too want to know full range of torque and HP....?

  10. #30
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    Brent from B2 Motorsports is still waiting for his acct to be activated.... here's his reply:

    Starting the graph at the torque peak is basically a function of the dyno software. Usually the torque peak is much lower than the horsepower peak (unless it's a narrow band drag motor or pulling motor). So using the two peaks as opposite ends on the graph usually provides a pretty broad set of curves.

    Each engine's pull is determined by its application. An engine that has all bottom end and no top end power would be pulled down lower than an engine with no bottom end and all top end power. A lot of this is a function of the camshaft and its powerband. You guys with experience on high-strung race motors know that they don't like to be pulled down low; they like to rev. When you get a revvy engine in your hands, the powerbands are shifted upward in the curve on both the torque and hp curves. As an extreme example, a Cup motor makes peak hp at 8800 and peak torque at 6500. Of course it wouldn't make sense to start a dyno pull at 1500 rpm. Nor would it make sense to start a diesel engine pull at 4000.

    In Mark's case, I informed the dyno operator of the application...a very light car with a low rearend gear and a torque monster of an engine. It's not really imperative to show what the engine makes at 2500 because you know it's going to be a lot. LOL The engine is making 475hp at only 4400 which is 50 hp more than a new Camaro SS at it's very peak. It's safe to say that at lower rpms, the hp and torque will be there.

    To load an engine down at just off idle speed would be extremely hard on the engine. You can actually get some detonation and bucking from loading an engine as hard as it can be loaded at a low rpm. Keep in mind that with a dyno, you have the ability to choke the engine out if you wanted to.

    I hope this answers some questions. I'm not very good at explaining things. If there's anything I can explain further, just let me know.

    Brent
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  11. #31
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    Avon Racing Tires

    Good to know, I run Avon motorcycle tires and they are made in England so all that fits.

    We have a member running those tires and there is a thread on them.

    Scott (Master) who has a 427 BB car in Cinn., OH. I think he likes the tires.
    Rick
    427 S/C , 427 Side-oiler, 4 Speed Close Ratio Top Loader, 3:73 Gear
    #4279405

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by eliminator View Post
    Good to know, I run Avon motorcycle tires and they are made in England so all that fits.

    We have a member running those tires and there is a thread on them.

    Scott (Master) who has a 427 BB car in Cinn., OH. I think he likes the tires.
    Thanks Rick, I'll check out the thread on the Avons. btw, while at Unique this past Friday, was looking at the Weaver's blue Cobra and noticed it had Avon's on it.
    Mark
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  13. #33
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    Apr 2010
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    Navarre, Florida
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    Rick, read the Avon thread and saw you mentioned you liked 275/60. I have an Excel sheet to calculate tire sizes.... here's the comparison:

    Mark
    (btw, anyone wanting this Excel doc... let me know your email addrs and I'll email to you.... its a very good tool for changing tire/wheel dia and comparing any changes.)

    UPDATE... the below was in a nice matrix format... easy to read, but the forum converted it to all text. So I added a Pict attachment to show how it would look in Excel.

    Fill in green cellsOriginal Equipment Tire:Aftermarket Tire:Tread Width (mm.)295Tread Width (mm.)275Sidewall Ratio50Sidewall Ratio60Rim Diameter (in.)15Rim Diameter (in.)15Tire Diameter (mm.)676.00Tire Diameter (mm.)711.00Tire Diameter (in.)26.61Tire Diameter (in.)27.99Sidewall Height (mm.)147.50Sidewall Height (mm.)165.00Sidewall Height (in.)5.81Sidewall Height (in.)6.50Tread Width (in.)11.61Tread Width (in.)10.83Tire RPM @60 mph757.90Tire RPM @60 mph720.59Difference Ratio5.18%Stock Final Gearing3.54SpeedometerError @ 60 mph57.05Mod Effective Gearing3.37
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by mkassab; July 13th, 2010 at 08:32 AM.
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  14. #34
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    Gadsden, Al , USA.
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    Our blue car has Yokohama Avid STs.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by weaver View Post
    Our blue car has Yokohama Avid STs.
    Gheezzzzzz... well Alan, you know I'm getting old, eyes bad, etc. when I looked at AVID and think I see AVON.... I need better glasses ! At least it has 4 letters and begins with AV..
    Last edited by mkassab; July 16th, 2010 at 05:03 AM.
    427 S/C, Flame Yellow, B2 Motorsports 427ci Stroker Dart SBF, TKO600, 3.73 Posi, Avon tires and so much more.

  16. #36
    WOOHOO! I'm alive now!

  17. #37
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    welcome B2

  18. #38
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    275/60 vs 295/50

    Mark,

    I have done the math and converted, now I am a fan of the 295's.

    I like both but the M/T's I just put on my car, 295's look better than the 275's (in my opinion).

    So I had to be convinced!!!!
    Last edited by eliminator; July 15th, 2010 at 12:26 PM.
    Rick
    427 S/C , 427 Side-oiler, 4 Speed Close Ratio Top Loader, 3:73 Gear
    #4279405

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by eliminator View Post
    Mark,

    I have done the math and converted, now I am a fan of the 295's.

    I like both but the M/T's I just put on my car look 295's look better than the 275's (in my opinion).

    So I had to be convinced!!!!

    Refresh my memory, Rick... have you posted pics of your car with the new tires yet?
    Paul

    289 USRRC
    1964 289 5-bolt block
    Toploader and 3.31 rear

  20. #40
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    No, not yet, although several people looked at them during Homecoming this year.
    Rick
    427 S/C , 427 Side-oiler, 4 Speed Close Ratio Top Loader, 3:73 Gear
    #4279405

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